Greatest All-Rounders (based on their career peaks)

Discussion in 'Cricket Talk' started by Mercenary, Jan 6, 2010.

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    Mercenary

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    Greatest All-Rounders (based on their career peaks)

    by Abdul Habib
    21st September 2003


    [IMG]


    What is the best way to gauge a players greatness? Is it his career average? Is it the average of his top 10 performances?

    Personally i believe that a players career average can be misleading due to frequent dips and peaks in form due to medical or even personal reasons. I think the best way to judge a players greatness is to work out when he hit peak form and then look at his figures to see just how good he was when he was on fire. After all when we choose an all-time XI we are assuming each player is performing to the best of his abilities aren’t we?

    Each player should be judged whilst performing at their peak level over a sustained period of 6 years. Anything less than 6 years wouldnt be a long enough period to ascertain true greatness and anything longer than 6 years would be unfairly weighted in favour of those players who never suffered a serious injury during their career.

    I'm putting my theory to the test with a list of 6 all rounders, i will only be using players who have retired and only one from each country in the top 8. I've missed out SL and SA because the players suggested to me as their greatest all rounders havent retired as yet. The players featured will be...

    Australia - Keith Miller
    England - Ian Botham
    India - Kapil Dev
    New Zealand - Richard Hadlee
    Pakistan - Imran Khan
    West Indies - Gary Sobers

    ...I chose all rounders because i can check for their batting peaks as well as their bowling peaks and even a combined peak. This should test the theory better than just comparing bowlers or batsmen. Each six year peak begins on the 1st day of the first year specified and ends on the last day of the last year specified, I've taken great pains to check every six year period of each players career and pick out the best one's for each discipline and for the combined discipline. Let the games begin!!!


    Batting

    Lets begin with comparing each players 6 year peak as a batsman, to qualify as an all time great batsman the bar is set at an average of 45 runs. This isnt as high (50 runs) as some would set but remember these arent dedicated batsmen so a little discretion should be used. Below i will list each players batting average during their 6 year peak as a batsman, a dotted line will divide the players into all time great batsmen and the rest...

    71.37 - Sobers (1958 - 1963)
    52.90 - Imran (1986 - 1991)
    -------------------------------
    40.02 - Miller (1947 - 1952)
    37.08 - Botham (1978 - 1983)
    34.43 - Hadlee (1982 - 1987)
    34.25 - Kapil (1982 - 1987)

    ...from the selection only two can be considered genuinely great batsmen and guaranteed a place on their batting skills alone. Imran has a very impressive 52.90, whilst Gary Sobers has an incredible 71.37. At the peak of every players skills as a batsman, only Imran Khan and Gary Sobers make the grade leaving the nearest contender (Miller) trailing by 12.88 runs to Imran and an incredible 31.35 runs (close to Kapil and Hadlee's peak batting average) to Sobers. Round 1 winners are Sobers and Imran!


    Bowling

    As test bowlers the most important aspect of their bowling would be their strike rate and then their average. The benchmark here will be set at a S/R below 55 combined with an average below 25. Once again the bowling figures below are from each players 6 year peak as a bowler and not their career figures. This time there will be two dotted lines, the players above the first one are all-time great bowlers (going by their figures) and the players above the second dotted line and below the first one will be great bowlers. Round 2..... Fight...

    154 wkts at an avg of 14.85 with a S/R of 40.9 for Imran (1981 - 1986)
    192 wkts at an avg of 18.31 with a S/R of 46.5 for Hadlee (1980 - 1985)
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
    267 wkts at an avg of 24.99 with a S/R of 53.5 for Botham (1978 - 1983)
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ~90 wkts at an avg of 21.86 with a S/R of 59.3 for Miller (1947 - 1952)
    239 wkts at an avg of 26.94 with a S/R of 53.6 for Kapil (1979 - 1984)
    ~89 wkts at an avg of 27.29 with a S/R of 72.2 for Sobers (1962 - 1967)

    ...Imran, Hadlee and Botham were all great bowlers at their peak but Hadlee and Imran were something else. During their respective 6 year peaks, Hadlee and Imran were all-time great bowlers and would probably make any team in the world as strike bowlers. Just look at that 40.9 S/R maintained by Imran for 6 years!!!

    Kapil and Miller were both unlucky to miss out because Kapil made the grade with his strike rate and Miller with his average but they didnt make the grade with their combined figures. Round 2 winners are Imran, Hadlee, and Botham.


    All Rounders

    The only player to reach the benchmark based on his 6 year peaks as both a batsman and a bowler was Imran Khan with a batting average of nearly 53 and a bowling average of 14.85 combined with a strike rate of 40.9, he really was an awesome player but does he win and is he the greatest all rounder ever?

    I think we should have one more round to decide because as impressive as those figures are his bowling peak was from 1981 to 1986 and his batting peak was from 1986 to 1991, so although at different stages in his career Imran was amazing at both disciplines. A truly great all rounder is one who is great at both disciplines at the same time, so lets have the deciding round and see who was the greatest all rounder of all time based on each players 6 year peak.

    Since we are looking at each players all round capabilities, i'll relent a little and lower the batting average and raise the S/R. The benchmark for the greatest all rounders will be a batting average of 40 and bowling figures with a S/R of below 60 combined with an average below 25!

    46.21 Batt avg. 167 wkts at an avg of 16.89 with a S/R of 42.8 for Imran
    (1982 - 1987)
    40.02 Batt avg. ~90 wkts at an avg of 21.86 with a S/R of 59.3 for Miller
    (1947 - 1952)
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------
    34.43 Batt avg. 218 wkts at an avg of 18.76 with a S/R of 46.2 for Hadlee
    (1982 - 1987)
    65.51 Batt avg. ~89 wkts at an avg of 27.29 with a S/R of 72.2 for Sobers
    (1962 - 1967)
    37.08 Batt avg. 267 wkts at an avg of 24.99 with a S/R of 53.5 for Botham
    (1978 - 1983)
    29.25 Batt avg. 239 wkts at an avg of 26.94 with a S/R of 53.6 for Kapil
    (1979 - 1984)

    ...Whilst there is no doubt in my mind that all the above were explosive match winners for their respective teams and each of them deserve to be be called great all rounders, there are only two (Imran and Miller) that met the benchmark set for the 'greatest' all rounders.

    Among the others some excelled in batting (Sobers) and others were incredible bowlers (Hadlee) but the greatest all rounder of them all is Imran Khan.

    In this last round he is head and shoulders above his nearest rival (Miller) for the all rounder slot in an all time test side, Imran has a batting average 6.19 runs above his nearest rival (second only to Sobers overall) and his bowling average is 4.97 runs below Miller combine that with a strike rate 16.5 balls (nearly 3 overs) less than the next best all rounder. Imran at his peak was the best all rounder that we have ever seen but looking at his peak bowling figures it makes me wonder just how close he is to being the best fast bowler of all time too!!!

    In addition to the above it's pertinent to mention Imran's playing record as captain. Imran captained Pakistan for 48 tests, that's more than half his career. In those 48 tests Imran averaged 52.34 with the bat and took 187 wickets at 20.26 with the ball. That's right Imran averaged 52 with the bat and 20 with the ball whilst holding together one of the most divisive teams in the history of all sport! Never before or after Imran has Pakistan ever been as united as it was under his leadership and it was his all-round performance which helped to give him the legitimacy he needed to do things his way.
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    Mercenary

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    Imran's stats are just out of this world but watching him was something else altogether. If he was around today he would our best batsman since Inzi.
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    zeenix

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    Well what i like about Imran is that it was his sheer determination that he overcame all odds. I remember he gave an interview once in which he stated that Waqar and Wasim had natural bowling actions, while he had to develop his bowling action. Plus due to injury Imran had to sit out during his peak. If he hadn't been out due to injury, his records already excellent by any criteria, would have been legendary and unsurpassable both in bowling and batting.

    Additionally what i like about Imran is that he proved by the results that once you put your mind to something, and genuinely work you would achieve it. Something our team could learn..
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    Rizzy

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    yeah i saw an interview where he said he auditioned to be a batsman but was told to bowl instead which he impressed with so was put into the team
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    Observer

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    No doubt Imran was a great player, but what impress me most is by time he developed an even greater devotion for his country (SKHM, Namal College and more to come). He has the potential for even greater achievements provided the Pakistanis can stop acting like idiots!

    So he is not just a great player. He also did show sportsmanship of the rare kind and above all he is a great human being! and that's a tremendous achievement. I salute Mr. Imran Khan!
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    HuskerFan

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    Excellent analysis and a very good read Merc.

    Since you mentioned the "peek" of the careers, and ICC rankings are based on the peeks (recent form), here is what I found at ICC website;

    Top 100 Batsmen Ranking:

    Only Sobers (#6) and Botham (#79) broke into top 100 ranking batsmen.
    Code:
    ID  	Rat.  	Name  	        Nat.  	Career Best Rating
    6  	938  	G.S. Sobers  	WI  	938 v India, 13/01/1967
    79  	811  	I.T. Botham  	ENG  	811 v India, 08/07/1982
    Imran's highest batting points were 650 - in 1991 after a test vs SL at Sialkot.


    Top 100 Bowler Ranking:

    All players except Sobers broke in to top 100 best ever bowler's ranking.

    Code:
    ID  	Rat.  	Name  	        Nat.  	Career Best Rating
     3  	922  	Imran Khan  	PAK  	922 v India, 30/01/1983
     8  	911  	I.T. Botham  	ENG  	911 v India, 15/02/1980
    10  	909  	R.J. Hadlee  	NZ  	909 v Australia, 30/11/1985
    35  	877  	Kapil Dev  	IND  	877 v Pakistan, 15/01/1980
    41  	862  	K.R. Miller  	AUS  	862 v South Africa, 09/01/1953
    Career All rounders Ranking for 6 Players:
    For all 6 player you listed, here is the the graph from ICC website.
    [IMG]
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    Joseph K.

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    Imran did not ebb away. He peaked and stayed at the peak of his game till his retirement. His planning was immaculate. He is the greatest Pak cricketer ever. His legacy showed itself in the waves and waves of genuine fast bowlers that his country produced after him. Unfortunately his real talent, planning a game and a career, was never learned by anybody else after him. Imran and Miandad always knew where they wanted to take a game of cricket. Their planning is what we miss now. Even Imran could not plan his political career as well as he did his sports career. Early alliances with some of the worst elements in our politics (for whatever reasons) lost him a lot of respect in my eyes. Still the point remains: he is our greatest cricketer and the foremost and most influential architect of cricket in our country. His stats may not be as good as others but he was in a different league in all others respects. His leadership, his personality, his charisma, his no nonsense commitment, they were all from out of this world. Only Viv Richards had the air of majesty that surrounded Imran. He did not lead a team that constantly underperformed like Hadley, he was not hit on the same toe by a young Akram on two consecutive deliveries like Botham did (swearing, cursing and limping all over the place!), he was not plastered all over Calcutta's Eden Garden by a young Salim Malik like Kapil Dev was. He entered games to win, to plan and fight when fighting was needed. His late onslaughts were a treat to watch.
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    Mercenary

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    Imran was more than an all-rounder on the pitch, he was a cricketing pioneer off the pitch too. He never gets credited with bringing neutral umpires into cricket.

    Before we had neutral umpires, cricket was a bit of a laughing stock when it came to officiating. Incidents like Umpire Palmer deciding his compatriot Graham Gooch wasn't run out a yard outside the crease were commonplace.
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    Harsh Thakor

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    Greatest allrounder

    Gary Sobers simply sits on another pedestal from other allrounders and is the greatest match-winning cricketer of all time.No cricketer ever could change the complexion of a game to such agreat extent as Sobers.Kallis statistically edges Sobers but has hardly performed outstandingly with both bat and ball in a sinle match or series or been a consistent match-winner like Sobers.I rate Sobers the greatest cricketer ever,even above Bradman.He could destroy the best of bolwing attacks with the bat to win games from a crisis and was incredibly verstaile asa bowler delivering pace ,spin nad chinaman.He also was a spectacular fielder.Remember Sober's all-round efforts in the 1970 and 1966 English seasons with both bat and ball.His 1970 efforts have never been equalled.

    Sober's closest challengers are Imran,Botham and Miller with Kallis just a notch below.In his peak from 1977-1982 Botham was the closest to Sobers.Remember his spectacular efforts in the 1980 Jubilee test in Mumbai and the 1981 Ashes. In a crisis Kallis was the best batsman amongst the great allrounders,who statistically is the champion .
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    Mercenary

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    @Thakor

    This was a statistical analysis and that fails to capture the essence of a cricketer.

    Sobers was (both statistically and aesthetically) one of the most amazing batsmen in the world. As a bowler his value lay in his versatility. He could bowl spin and seam with equal dexterity but that didnt make him outstanding as a bowler. He was a useful option because he offered more variation an flexibility to his captain than other bowlers.

    You've clocked Botham right, his peak came during the period when all the World's best cricketers were playing for Kerry Packer. As soon as they returned, Botham was about as effective and as consistent as a Shahid Afridi. He was mercurial and no way in the class of a Sobers or Imran.

    Kallis was a statistical superman but he never had that X factor which made him stand out from the crowd.
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    thair9999

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    I don't know why "Jacques Kallis" is not considered as one of the greatest. If you look at his Test States only he is at par with "Garry Sobers"

    Average Kallis Sobers
    Batting 57.43 57.78
    Bowling 32.01 34.03

    And Sobers only played 1 ODI so there is no comparison.
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    Shahzad.Firdous

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    best allrounders for me
    1. Imran Khan'
    2. Flintoff / Shahid Afridi
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    Mercenary

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    Statistically they are a match and you could argue that Kallis has played against better conditioned athletes and had a heavier workload. You could also point out that Kallis has played in the full scrutiny of the video analysis age where a players every weakness is highlighted and then magnified. Sobers on the other hand not only had an amateurs love and attitude to cricket but he also benefited from the less professional tactics and scouting employed in those days.

    But despite all that you'd be hardpressed to find anyone who rates Kallis over Sobers.

    One thing to bear in mind is that during the era of Sobers (30 Mar 1954 to 30 Mar 1974) only 6 players averaged over 50 (qual. of 20+ tests).

    During the career of Kallis (14 Dec 1995 to Present) there have been 18 batsmen who have averaged over 50 (qual. of 20+ tests).

    As you can see, Sobers stood out as one of only 6 batsmen whereas Kallis is one of 18.
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    Mercenary

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    Shahid Afridi? I hope you're being sarcastic. :)
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    Harsh Thakor

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    Mercenary I think your analysis is extremely unfair to Ian Botham.In his peak Botham was the best match-winning allrounder of all. Remember his haul of 13 wickets and a century against India in the Jubillee test at Mumbai when all seemed lost and the 1981 Ashes when he won a series for his team from the jaws of defeat with his 149 not out at Leeds and his 5-11 at Edgbaston.Even Sobers has not equalled this performance.Botham captured 5 wks and scored a hundred 5 times -a record and was the fastest to complete the 200 wkt and 3000 run double.Imran Khan hardly peformed oustandingly both with bat and ball in amatch or series .From 1977-1882 Botham was the best since Sobers.His explosive batting and deceptive swing bolwing in addition to his magnificient slip catching made him the Sobers of his day.I agree Imran Khan was more consistent in his career and a greater complement to Sobers in a world being the graeter bowler but as a pure all-rounder Botham may well edge Imran. In 3 analyses of Ananth Narayana Botham marginally edges Imran.What went against Botham was his performces agaisnt West Indies but then don't forget his 8-103 and score of 81 at Lords in 1984 against the WEst Indies.

    Imran Khan overshadowed Botham in both series against England in 1977 and 1982 but became a great batsmen late in his career,peaking from 1988-1992.

    Jacques Kallis in a crisis may have surpassed Sobers as a batsman but simply lacks the match-winning flair.

    Asa pure all-rounder Keith Miller and Ian Botham come closer to Sobers than Kallis or Imran,being able to silmuntaneously shine with bat and ball.What stands in favour of Imran was his great match-winning flair while Kallis has credibility in the fact that statistically he is the greatest of all cricketers.
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    Harsh Thakor

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    My personal ratings are
    1.Gary Sobers
    2.Keith Miller
    3.Imran Khan
    4.Ian Botham
    5.JacquesKallis
    6.Kapil Dev
    7.Richard Hadlee
    8.Shaun Pollock
    9.Mike Procter
    10.Tony Greig
    11.Chris Carns
    12.Andrew Flintoff

    Statistics simply does not do Sobers justice .Even if Kallis has better figures he could never consistently make such an impact on the course of a match like Sobers.Gary could bowl,fast,medium,spin nad chinaman which no great bowler could do.Only Botham at his best could match Gary as amatch-winner with both ball and bat. At his beset Kallis could never decimate the opposition like Sobers.One must remember that in Gary’s era very few batsmen even averaged above 50 ,infact it was only three.In the modern era atleast 7-8 batsmen average above 50.In Sobers ear the bowling strike rates were far lower than today and in that light Sobers bolwing compared to his peers was considerably aheadof Kallis.Graeme Pollock rates him the best allrounder ever.To Ray Robinson, Sobers was "evolution's ultimate specimen in cricketers". He combined faculties of the game as no other, batting from one to nine in the West Indies order, bowling every variety of left-arm delivery, fielding in every position with uniform excellence and captaining with a knowledge that his predecessor Frank Worrell described as encompassing "everything" - this for two decades, with only the barest attenuation in performance as age encroached.

    Keith Miller was in pure averages better than Botham, Richard Hadlee or Kapil Dev and almost equal to Imran Khan .Had he played in the modern era he may have been rated much higher.He was an able partner to Ray Lindwall,and often gave aclassical display of batsmanship.At his best against West Indies. Averaged 22.97 ,capturing 170 wickets with the ball,and scored 2000 runs at 36 runs apiece with the bat.I have scaled Miller’s figures for his era when bolwing strike rates were far lower and fewer test matches were played.

    Miller has better bowling and batting averages than Botham and overall was more consisitent as a cricketer.Imran Khan has superior stats but was not Miller’s equal with both ball and bat in atset match or a series.Alan Dadidson,the great Australian left arm fast bowler considers Keith Miller the best of all all-rounders as he felt that the fast bowlers won matches.
    In his first full series Miller averaged 76.8 with bat and 20.88 with the ball.In the 195051 Ashes series he topped the batting aveeages and captured 17 wickets.A season later he scored a hundred against the West Indies. In a series and also captured 5 wicket stwice.In West Indies in 195 he scored 439 runs at an average of 73 runs.
    I have rated Miller second as any stats ratings cannot do him justice as the era he played for was completely different from Sobers or Imran and on merit his allround performance index is much higher.Miller has avery high rating in allround performance ratings

    Keith Miller was in pure averages better than Botham, Richard Hadlee or Kapil Dev and almost equal to Imran Khan .Had he played in the modern era he may have been rated much higher.He was an able partner to Ray Lindwall,and often gave aclassical display of batsmanship.At his best against West Indies. Averaged 22.97 ,capturing 170 wickets with the ball,and scored 2000 runs at 36 runs apiece with the bat.I have scaled Miller’s figures for his era when bolwing strike rates were far lower and fewer test matches were played.

    Miller has better bowling and batting averages than Botham and overall was more consisitent as a cricketer.Imran Khan has superior stats but was not Miller’s equal with both ball and bat in atset match or a series.Alan Dadidson,the great Australian left arm fast bowler considers Keith Miller the best of all all-rounders as he felt that the fast bowlers won matches.
    In his first full series Miller averaged 76.8 with bat and 20.88 with the ball.In the 195051 Ashes series he topped the batting aveeages and captured 17 wickets.A season later he scored a hundred against the West Indies. In a series and also captured 5 wicket stwice.In West Indies in 195 he scored 439 runs at an average of 73 runs.
    I have rated Miller second as any stats ratings cannot do him justice as the era he played for was completely different from Sobers or Imran and on merit his allround performance index is much higher.Miller has avery high rating in allround performance ratings


    Imran Khan at his best was the greatest all-rounder of his era,from 1980-88. Staistically third,behind only Sobers and Kallis in term sof difference between batting and bolwing averages. From 1981-1987 overshadowed Kapil Dev,Ian Botham and Richard Hadlee to crown himself the king of all-rounders.Also the greatest leader amongst all all-rounders.

    .Significantly in both series he played against England in England in 1982 and 1987 his performances overshadowed Ian Botham with both ball and bat.In 1982 in England in 3 tests he scored 318 runs at an average of 53 and took 21 wickets at an average of 18.53.However as he became a great batsman only late in his career he was mainly a fast bowling all-rounder.Although statistically, behind only Kallis Imran could not equally change the fortunes of a match with the bat as much as he could with the ball. In that respect Ian Botham or Kapil Dev scored over him.However he was overall more consistent than Botham or Kapil.From 1988-1992 he batted like a champion averaging 53 runs..

    Ian Botham,In his early days the of all From 1977-82 the best allrounder and greatest imatch-winning allrounder after Sobers. Botham has captured 5 wickets and scored a century in the same match a record 5 times In terms of excellence in all-round performance ratings Botham is second only to Gary Sobers with a rating of 11.07 compared to Sober’s 13.74.The best batsman amongst the 4 great allrounders of his era.Had he maintained the same consisitency as the first half of his career may have joined Sobers.

    Jacques Kallis was Statistically, the greatest all-rounder ever .Scored 11,000 runs and captured 270 wickets. In the modern era few batsman have been as consistent in a crisis . A champion batsman in all types of conditions from the moving English pitches, the turning tracks on the sub –continent . He averages over 55 and can deliver the best of his goods in tune with the situation. Formerly A brilliant medium-pace bowler on green seaming tops, with the ability to make the ball deviate through the air. He also has amazing stats in one day games. Unlike Sobers who came in at no 6 Kallis came in at one or two down and even bowled at one –change.


    However remember he has played far more test matches than Gary Sobers and also benefited in playing against weaker opposition like Zimbabwe ,Sri Lanka,Bangladesh etc.. Kallis also was not a consistent match-winner like Sobers,Imran or Botham and has not changed the complexion of a match or series equally with the bat and ball. In his early carer excelled with both ball and bat but in the second half was virtually reduced to a great batsman.Infact Kalli’s batting style was more conducive to saving rather than winning test matches..
    Where Kalis has credentials is that he has had to combat greater opposition and also had to baer a greater brunt of his taem’s batting.In a crisis he is arguably the best batsman amongst all the great allrounders and also the best post-war batsman.In the early part of his career excelled with bat and ball and had his bolwing made a similar impact in the last half of his carrer would have been morally in the Sober’s league.


    Top allrounders between 1980 and 1988 (Qual: 1500 runs, 100 wickets)
    Player Tests Runs Average 100s/ 50s Wickets Average 5WI/ 10WM Diff in ave
    Imran Khan 48 2028 39.76 4/ 10 236 17.77 18/ 5 21.99
    Richard Hadlee 51 1987 31.04 2/ 10 284 19.03 28/ 7 12.01
    Ian Botham 72 3989 34.38 10/ 19 255 31.83 15/ 2 2.55
    Kapil Dev 72 3103 31.98 5/ 16 242 30.05 14/ 2 1.93
    Ravi Shastri 61 2702 34.64 7/ 10 132 38.24 2/ 0 -3.60
    In fact, extending this analysis to all Test cricket, only Sobers had a higher difference between batting and bowling averages (among those with at least 3000 runs and 200 wickets, and two wickets per Test). Jacques Kallis is the other allrounder who has more than 3000 runs and 200 wickets - and a huge difference between batting and bowling averages - but for much of his career Kallis has been a batsman who bowls a bit: his 266 wickets have come from 140 Tests, an average of less than two wickets per match.















    Ian Botham's record

    A career of two distinct halves
    Runs Average 100s/ 50s Wickets Average 5WI/ 10WM
    First 51 Tests 2833 38.80 11/ 10 231 23.06 19/ 4
    Next 37 Tests 1976 31.36 3/ 11 135 33.85 8/ 0
    Last 14 Tests 391 20.57 0/ 1 17 57.52 0/ 0
    Career (102 Tests) 5200 33.54 14/ 22 383 28.40 27/
    During the six years when Botham was at his peak, he was the best of the four allrounders going around during that period. Imran Khan, Kapil Dev and Richard Hadlee were tremendous too - though Hadlee's best was to come later - but none of them matched Botham's consistency with bat and ball. During this period, the difference between Botham's batting and bowling average was 12.59. Imran and Hadlee had better bowling averages, but neither matched Botham as a batsman (though Imran's best as a batsman was to come later).
    The four leading allrounders between Jan 1977 and Dec 1982
    Player Tests Runs Average 100s/ 50s Wickets Average 5WI/ 10WM Diff in ave
    Ian Botham 58 3229 37.11 11/ 13 262 24.52 20/ 4 12.59
    Imran Khan 37 1429 29.16 1/ 4 186 21.79 13/ 3 7.37
    Kapil Dev 44 1904 32.82 2/ 11 172 29.68 13/ 1 3.14
    Richard Hadlee 23 767 21.91 1/ 4 114 23.22 11/ 2 -1.31
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    CORNERED TIGER

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    Imran Khan
    any day... a leader
    imran could get in any team as a specialist batsman
    imran could get in any team as front line bowler
    imran would be my skipper 4 any all time world 11
    and above all imran led from front...
    wich im sorry 2 say none of the players above have ever done ... may be kapil dev... but others really sucked at it....
    people keep saying gary sobers this n that... fair enough... his stats are awesome...
    but what sobers achived with bat imran did the same with ball
    but what imran achived with ball sobers in my opinion never achived in bowling
    although
    not being biased il put
    sobers & imran @ number 1
    and then its just a numbers game!
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    Sir John

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    kapil played with less effective bowlers
  19. Offline

    Sir John

    Joined: May 25, 2010
    Posts: 6,290
    Likes: 181
    Points: 63
  20. Offline

    Sir John

    Joined: May 25, 2010
    Posts: 6,290
    Likes: 181
    Points: 63
  21. Offline

    CORNERED TIGER

    Joined: Nov 2, 2010
    Posts: 716
    Likes: 31
    Points: 28
    so whats ur point?
    make any sense my friend
    mcgrath had warne glllespie lee
    so does that makes mcgrath bowling figures bad?
    or wasim had waqar or waqar had wasim makes any sense?

    imran led from the front 50 plus average with bat in test cricket while being the captain

    19 with the ball while being the captain

    wat else u want? fish n chips?
  22. Offline

    Sir John

    Joined: May 25, 2010
    Posts: 6,290
    Likes: 181
    Points: 63
    i mean that time india did't have pace as a strength.

    check with whom kapil had played.
  23. Offline

    Sir John

    Joined: May 25, 2010
    Posts: 6,290
    Likes: 181
    Points: 63
  24. Offline

    Sir John

    Joined: May 25, 2010
    Posts: 6,290
    Likes: 181
    Points: 63
  25. Offline

    Sir John

    Joined: May 25, 2010
    Posts: 6,290
    Likes: 181
    Points: 63
    imran always get support from other end,but kapil never.
  26. Offline

    Amar

    Joined: Jun 4, 2010
    Posts: 267
    Likes: 24
    Points: 18
    Imran Khan all time best.
  27. Offline

    CORNERED TIGER

    Joined: Nov 2, 2010
    Posts: 716
    Likes: 31
    Points: 28
    Imran Khan...Naam Hi Kafi Hai.
    Khan Rules
  28. Offline

    ALbIe

    Joined: Nov 3, 2010
    Posts: 3,524
    Likes: 1,191
    Points: 113
    wasim akram could have been the greatest all rounder

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